Speaker 1: 0:00

This episode sponsored by Kathy L Wall, state Farm Agency. Learn more at KathyLWALLcom. And Stuart Arango, oral Surgery. Learn more at SAOralsurgeonscom. Welcome to the Bubble Lounge.

Speaker 1: 0:18

I'm Martha Jackson and I have been noticing a lot of new small businesses opening up around the neighborhood. One of the main reasons that we started this podcast was to support these small businesses and help shine a light on them and help them thrive any way we could. One of my favorite small businesses in the neighborhood is Chapa Vara. Emily Wickard started this business a few years ago out of her home and has developed it into this major brand, not just in our neighborhood but across the country.

Speaker 1: 0:44

But one of the biggest things that has always impressed me about Emily is her presence on social media. I feel like she never went through an awkward face, she just jumped right in, figured it out and has grown her business tremendously through social media. But it wasn't always that easy for Emily, so I invited her in just to share all the things that she went through to grow her business, so she could pass that information to all you small business owners out there. So if you're struggling to grow your business on Instagram and TikTok, this episode is a must listen to. You are going to absolutely love all the things that Emily shares in this episode. Emily, welcome to the show.

Speaker 2: 1:21

Thank you, martha, I'm so happy to be back.

Speaker 1: 1:25

Well, it's been a while since you've joined us and, like I was telling you when I invited you to come back, is there's so many new small local businesses popping up in our neighborhood and around the area, and I was telling you that I feel like social media has become such a necessity for small businesses and you are one of our local businesses that I feel like you just got it right like off the bat. You never went through this awkward period.

Speaker 2: 1:50

You don't have any embarrassing videos out there like oh, there are some, martha, I can tell you there are. I may have deleted them, but they were there at some point.

Speaker 1: 1:58

Well, it happens to the best of us, but I wanted you to share your wisdom with all the small businesses out there of just how you made this all happen.

Speaker 2: 2:05

Absolutely Well. So just to give you a little background, I had worked the first 20 years of my career in finance, and so I had an opportunity to leave the role that I was in. I had two kids one in three and I just really wanted to find something that I was passionate about and fashion had always been my passion and so I saw other women, you know, opening boutiques around town and I thought that was great, but I knew nothing about the industry. So I Googled how to start an online boutique and, you know, I saw how women were not necessarily creating brick and mortar stores, but were really leveraging social media to sell their product. And so I started in our Park City's online yard sale Facebook group and, yeah, I developed the following there just by selling I modeled the clothes myself and selling new clothing on there. So that's how my first foray into social media was on Facebook.

Speaker 1: 3:05

Well, I do remember, just like it was yesterday coming to your house to come pick things up on the side of your house in the containers, absolutely.

Speaker 2: 3:12

Purchase pickup. Yes, yes, yes. Look how far you've come. It has been wild, yeah. I mean for me, you know, when I just never envisioned this becoming something that was like a big business. I just loved finding unique clothing that was affordable, that ladies got excited about, and selling it however I could, and so I went pretty quickly from Facebook onto Instagram, and when I joined Instagram, I literally did not have an Instagram account, so I had zero followers and you know I was smart. And then I surrounded myself with really smart women who are young and understand social media. I started with a couple interns who knew the platform and slowly over time, they helped me sort of develop our brand identity on Instagram and it has been just an amazing platform for us. And what's great about it is you don't have to invest a lot of capital for a brick and mortar store. You can really grow a business leveraging social media.

Speaker 1: 4:11

Right, right, it's, it's. It's fairly affordable and I can say without question that people wouldn't know about the Bubble Launch podcast if it wasn't for Instagram, primarily we do a little bit better over there than Facebook, but it's just such a good way to stay top of mind of your customers and just constantly let them know what's going on and what's new. I mean, in your business that's a daily thing with with all the inventory that you all have.

Speaker 2: 4:36

Yeah, absolutely. I mean for me, not knowing a lot about the platform, you know, I just was really concerned about making sure we connected with our customers. So Instagram isn't just hey, we're selling this piece of clothing, it's me modeling the clothing because I didn't know any models. So I figured, OK, I'm going to put the clothes on myself, model them, and then really during COVID, when women couldn't come to the house and shop, I would record fit videos is what I call them and I would talk about the clothing, how they fit, how they felt, and that has really resonated.

Speaker 2: 5:10

And again, I think what it is is having the connection. And, yes, I'm the face of the brand, but I wouldn't sell anything that I wouldn't wear. So I think that is an aspect of social media that you wouldn't necessarily get in an email or on a website. You're really developing a personal connection with your customers and you're bringing them along on the journey. With Instagram, we do so much behind the scenes. We just launched our resort collection today and that has been amazing. We brought our followers along when we traveled to Miami and we shot all the clothing there and they really feel like they've been a part of seeing Avara grow through Instagram.

Speaker 1: 5:48

Well, just right there, what you're saying is that sense of community. I do a lot of research on trying to figure out my own Instagram and just building that community and letting people know you're a real human being behind this brand. Absolutely. And I think that forming that connection is so important because the more they like you and the more they trust you, the more they're going to buy from you Absolutely, and that sort of segues into.

Speaker 2: 6:11

When I first got onto Instagram, I wasn't even familiar with influencers or ambassadors and I started seeing other women and they weren't necessarily selling their own clothing through a store, but they were influencing and I was really anti-influencers at first. I said, oh, I don't like that. I really preconceived notions on sort of what an influencer was and I didn't trust them. And I remember one reaching out to us and she actually her name is Natasha, she lives in Nashville, she is still our number two, is our first and still our biggest influencer. But she said I love your clothing, I would love to feature it on my Instagram account. And reluctantly we allowed her and I mean, you know, I look back and I say, boy, I didn't know what, I didn't know. She is just so authentically herself. She is someone who's colorful, real. You know, we look for women to represent Avara that really, you know, aren't just about selling clothing but are about developing relationships with their communities that follow them. So leveraging not only Instagram but those affiliate partnerships has just been incredible for Avara.

Speaker 1: 7:18

Well, tell me, when you were first working with an influencer or an ambassador, what are you looking for and kind of describe the relationship and how that?

Speaker 2: 7:28

works, absolutely so with Avara. You know, what is interesting is, if you go on Instagram, so many of the women are younger, they tend to have sort of a more neutral aesthetic. So finding women that are into feminine, colorful, compliment worthy as we say clothing was harder than we thought and over time, you know again, we really look at women's videos when they're talking to their customers, how they present themselves, you can just tell. You know, you can tell when an affiliate partner is really excited about the brand and, trust me, they don't all work. You know we have some that we think oh, she's going to be a great fit for the brand and they just don't convert. You know, that would be the one thing I would say to anyone thinking about leveraging either social media or an influencer program try and, try and try and you will fail, you know. But I don't think you're taking enough risk if some of those things don't come to fruition.

Speaker 1: 8:26

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Speaker 1: 9:28

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Speaker 1: 10:06

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Speaker 1: 10:40

I'm very much a color girl, heck yeah, much like you. That's why I think I like your brand so much, Absolutely Well.

Speaker 2: 10:45

We love that.

Speaker 1: 10:46

And I don't understand that. It must appeal to people, but it doesn't appeal to me.

Speaker 2: 10:51

Agree and I think that's what is made of our so successful in such a short period of time was we do offer a line that is a little bit different. You know you can walk into an anthropology or a Nordstrom I mean there's so many choices, right but Avarra really does curate across a matrix of brands. We design almost 40% of all the pieces we sell ourselves. I mean, we feel like we have an unserved market with our customers, so that colorful, feminine, affordable look that you don't see everywhere is something that again, really resonates with our audience.

Speaker 1: 11:28

Well, I know a lot of the small business owners are going to want to know this question. So are you able to say, just kind of big picture, what working with an influencer cost? Is there a trade out? Is there money? A little bit of everything.

Speaker 2: 11:43

Great question, and what my Influencer Manager always says is it is truly the wild, wild West. So we work with influencers who have a couple thousand followers to. An influencer has over a million followers, and these women are from ages 22 to 67. It really does depend. Some are being paid by the post, so they say if you want us to feed the bread, it's a flat fee. Pay us and we'll put your pieces on the story. And most get commissions. So on every dollar they sell, they get a certain percentage of commission on those pieces. So it is really.

Speaker 2: 12:21

I wish I had a standard way, you know approach, but there is that I remember in our early days like to know it is the platform that really facilitates the transactions between the influencers and businesses. I remember they said to us well, you could run a campaign with us and it cost $20,000. And they would have just could have told me it was $20 million, $20,000. I said they are crazy. So instead I hired a couple of college interns and we scoured Instagram and we found women. We thought we'd like the brand and we sent them PR packages and we introduced the brand to them and some bit and some didn't, but those that did, we started developing a critical mass and more of a brand identity with influencers out there. So, but yeah, try, try again, be consistent and, you know, jump on the trends. Tick Tox is something I do that people enjoy, and reels and videos, really allowing the audience to see you as you.

Speaker 1: 13:18

Right, right. Well, I just think it's such a brilliant mix to add into your marketing mix is because most of us do follow influencers, I'm kind of having a hard time finding those that I like, that are kind of in my age bracket.

Speaker 2: 13:30

It is hard, martha. You need to become one. You'd be terrific. Let's talk after this. We'll get you an influencer contract with Avara. It's a deal.

Speaker 1: 13:39

Do you have a product or business you want to introduce to families in Highland Park, then we want to work with you.

Speaker 1: 13:45

With over 140,000 listeners and more than 200 episodes and a strong Instagram community, the Bubble Lounge Podcast is the perfect way to connect with families in the park cities. Visit bubbleloungenet to learn more. Hey friends, if you love this episode or you're a fan of the Bubble Lounge Podcast, follow us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Just tap the follow button at the top of the screen if you're a fan of the Bubble Lounge and, even better, send me a text message with the word bubble to 469-757-2500. Just open your messages, type in my number, 469-757-2500, with the message bubble. Once you send me a text, I will add you to our list and send you a text message whenever a new episode is published. So follow us on Apple Podcasts and make sure to send me a text so you'll never miss an episode. You find those that you relate to and you like their style, and then, all of a sudden, here they are modeling different clothes, and I'll tell you what it works for me. I've bought a lot of things from different influencers.

Speaker 2: 14:51

Absolutely, and I think too, like with fashion, it's constantly evolving. When we started Avara, we didn't really do a lot of prints which sounds crazy now because a lot of what we do are prints but we were more solid staple pieces and again, fashion's evolved. You know we talk about this summer. You're seeing a lot of crochet. They call it beach office, so stripes, sort of think Hampton's vibe. So you're gonna be starting to see some of that being incorporated into Avara's line. But it's still Avara at the end of the day, it's still on brand, even though the aesthetic changes because the trends change. I mean that's what makes it fun.

Speaker 1: 15:28

Well, let's switch gears to the algorithm, the ever-changing algorithm. I am like constantly trying to figure that thing out and I feel like once I finally think I have it, it changes.

Speaker 2: 15:39

So what got you?

Speaker 1: 15:40

discovered last week now gets you not to discover. Absolutely true. How do you stay on top of?

Speaker 2: 15:45

this. You know what's so funny? I don't, and that's an easy answer. But what I have found is and this is just after five years of doing this BU, you know of course there are gonna be ebbs and flows and likes and views.

Speaker 2: 16:00

Some people are really into analytics around the algorithm. I just have found in my experience, if we stay true to who we are and if we like something you know the TikToks I referenced earlier but Instagram results will do funny mom moments, you know, and of course I'll be wearing a varra, but you know relatable moments that are funny. You know we started off doing those, we weren't getting any likes and no one was looking at them, and you know we could have just stopped because you know the algorithm or whatever didn't obviously favor what we were showing, but we stuck with it because we liked it. You know, and I think that eventually comes out on top. You know, really and truly being authentic to whoever you are. I think that's the thing that people do. They try to be like others or they try to. They see everyone doing something and they try it themselves and you sure sometimes it works, but it's gotta feel authentic to who you are and, in our case, are of our brand.

Speaker 1: 16:55

I think that's really good advice. I too am guilty sometimes of getting hung up on numbers oh, we all are. And I drive myself crazy and Sean's constantly getting on to me.

Speaker 2: 17:03

He's like those are just vanity matrixes. So you do not need to worry about that. He's right.

Speaker 1: 17:08

So you just confirmed he is right. He would love to hear that.

Speaker 2: 17:11

Okay, I'll let him know. He'll get some browning points for Sean.

Speaker 1: 17:14

Well, you guys have achieved such impressive cells growth. I mean, I've been with you since almost the beginning. Yeah, Like I said, still remember coming over to your side yard and opening those little containers and then wow look at you now, but what do you feel like is? That is some of your tips that you could share, that have taken you to this point.

Speaker 2: 17:34

Absolutely, I think. I mean I wouldn't, it wouldn't be genuine. I mean not say the 20 years I had in business are helpful, right, I mean I had a finance background so I knew a little bit about you know business and metrics to look at. But as far as just with Avarra, again I would say that if you are passionate about what you do, you know whether you're filling an order or putting packages out on the side bin of the house or we had our Pieces featured on the Today Show. You know, regardless of what you're doing, you're enjoying it.

Speaker 2: 18:05

I think finding something that is your passion, that serves an untapped market, is really, really important. And you know, the best advice I have is just get started. So many women think, okay, I got to plan all this in this right time, in this right moment. Just get started, even if it's small. And when you fail because you will fail at some point, you know keep going. One of the biggest, you know, turning points I had in Avarra's past is when UP sent me a cease and desist. I said you're running an illegal business out of your home. You can't do this because of our Jesus. Everybody knew about it and I thought what am I going to do. You know, this is it, it's over. Well, guess what? We have a store on lovers, you know people can come shop there, and we have Avarra East as all 50 states now, so we've really been able to leverage the e-commerce aspect of the business and work terrifically.

Speaker 1: 19:04

Well, and that's a piece of its own is e-commerce. Yes, it's a lot to figure out for most people and I bet there was a big learning curve for you there there was for sure.

Speaker 2: 19:13

Early on probably around 2020-21, we engaged an ad agency, so they really help us run our social media. They help us run Google shopping when you see Avarra suggested in Google shopping, they help us run that. Things like SEO, that I know the letters, but I'm not sure what it means. Having trusted partners along the way is really, really important to you. We by no means do all of this by ourselves.

Speaker 1: 19:39

So we were talking earlier of how I was telling you I felt like you never went through that weird, awkward phase of your posting and your content, everything I most certainly did, and I've just always found it kind of overwhelming as far as what to know to post, how much to post.

Speaker 1: 19:55

You see so many people posting multiple reels, multiple stories every single day. Do you have a process in place as far as an editorial calendar? Do you record things ahead of time, batch them up Great question. Then release them. How do you handle this? And it's definitely evolved.

Speaker 2: 20:12

But what I've really learned is obviously, at Avarra, we're releasing new products twice a week. So really everything we do from social media is to support those launches. But for me, one of the things I said my God, am I going to be creating videos every day and shooting pictures? There's this amazing concept called batching content. So before I came here, I did fit videos and new release videos for all of the pieces that will be launched next week. So we have once a week where I go in, I do all my fit videos, batch that content and go. So that has been incredibly helpful.

Speaker 2: 20:45

Now, what I do think you need to mix that with is authentic in the moment content. Right the other day, I had wrapped up doing fit videos and I looked around my office and it was just like a bomb went off and I said I'm going to show this because I need these women to see what it's really like or there's something interesting going on. That's really in the moment. I think if you mix those two together, there isn't this big pressure that you have to post a certain number of times a day. You have to do a certain number of reels. I think consistency is key. You need to be in a business like mine, certainly posting once a day to the feed.

Speaker 2: 21:21

But stories which is where we talked about batching content are really those 60-second clips where you can show a product or show, tell a story or what's going on in Avarra. We leverage those but again, we're working way ahead, so we're always batching content. I am someone who could not be an influencer who's having to record content every day and here's what I ate for breakfast and took my kids to school. I have no interest in that, nor would anyone have interest in following me, because it's really boring. But with a business where you're actually selling something, you can really plan ahead. So for a business owner or someone who's wanting to sell products online, you can really work smart and not have that consume your time.

Speaker 1: 22:06

Right, so just basically invest the time up front and then scatter it out for the next week, exactly.

Speaker 2: 22:13

Get on a schedule, batch that content, record it all, get your hair and makeup done, do what you need to do and then release it over the coming week. That's really arcades.

Speaker 1: 22:21

Well, I like what you said. I feel like a few years ago, the Instagram experts gave us permission and told us you do not have to have perfect videos. The less perfect that you show yourself as the more relatable you are, and I do think it's funny. I love seeing people's messy office. It makes me realize. Guess what? I'm not the only one you know.

Speaker 2: 22:41

Absolutely, and I think one of the things I was really concerned about when I first did this is I never wanted anyone to see me at my best in Highland Park Village, with my hair and makeup done everything beautiful. That is not real life. That's me in a moment, with a great photographer and lighting. I wanted people to know that, hey, I'm a real person with real challenge. I talk a lot. I'm a 7-year sober, so I talk a lot about being in recovery. I mean things that necessarily I wouldn't have shared when I started. But I want women to know Like, just because you see something from an influencer or someone on Instagram doesn't mean that's a reality. I think a lot of people have figured that out over the years.

Speaker 1: 23:21

That is just so true. I think that doing COVID, the influencer world kind of changed quite a bit Absolutely, because their lives were no longer easy to paint in this perfect fashion. Exactly. They're kind of letting their flaws out a little bit more, and I've noticed that they've all kind of changed along the way they have.

Speaker 2: 23:38

I mean, alex Earl is someone who she's young but a huge TikToker, and she spoke about how she just wasn't getting engagement and it wasn't resonating her content. She finally started talking about her acne and how awful it was Right, but she said, my God, it was like that was the click. People said, okay, like she's real, and from there now she has millions of followers and I think she's dating some NFL or so you know what? Show your flaws, because it's something that really resonates with people. We're all human and no one is perfect, no matter what they try to show you on Instagram.

Speaker 1: 24:10

Absolutely Okay. One of the big negatives about being on social media so much is you're really putting yourself out there to a lot of people who some you know, and then there's a lot of exposure to people you don't know and sometimes we can get some rude comments coming in. How do you deal with the trolls out there? Gosh.

Speaker 2: 24:28

I am a people pleaser, I want you to like me, and so when I first started, I was reading all the comments myself and it was always me for the 10 positive comments there'd be that one that would stick with me.

Speaker 2: 24:39

And what I learned over time is it's a lot of noise. You know, it was hard at first, but I kind of have of the mindset is, right now I'm fortunate enough to have someone handle my social media. I don't read any of the good comments and I don't read any of the bad, so it's sort of everyone's entitled to their opinion and it's one of those things that's a necessary evil. I say you know, in some ways that means we're getting ourselves out there and people are seeing us. But it's something that you have to deal with and you have to have thick enough skin to say I know who I am, I know what I'm doing and you know what I'm going to hold the course, and the worst thing you could do is listen to the trolls, because they definitely don't have your best interest at heart or engage with them.

Speaker 1: 25:19

Oh gosh, that's the worst. Yeah, kill them with kindness.

Speaker 2: 25:22

That's always been my motto.

Speaker 1: 25:24

Well, I've just never understood why somebody, if someone's post-rebs in the wrong way, why can't they just keep going? Why do they feel like they?

Speaker 2: 25:31

need to just live it all out. They can unfollow us right.

Speaker 1: 25:33

That's just novel concept. Yes, it's a powerful thing to unfollow somebody, Right? Well, so a lot of the business owners out there that I talked to have just told me point blank Martha, I'm just not comfortable being on camera and I feel like if people could get to know them, I really think it would improve their business. What advice do you have for people that aren't comfortable?

Speaker 2: 25:53

So true, I mean, I was in corporate finance, as I said, for 20 years doing spreadsheets, going to meetings. I had absolutely zero experience getting in front of a camera or speaking about clothing. And again, it was kind of during COVID, out of necessity. I just did it when I would say, well, what new do you have and show me? And I would record these videos. And, my God, I look back I promise some are pretty awful.

Speaker 2: 26:15

But I just did it and I said to myself what am I trying to do here? I'm trying to explain this clothing. When would I wear it? How does it feel, how does it fit? And I really just focused on the content and what I was trying to communicate and tried not to get too worried about how I looked or how I sounded. And again, the more practice, practice, practice, the more you're just willing to put yourself out there, the better. I had so many friends and, frankly, so many women in the park cities that were like encouraging me and no matter what I put out, there were like keep going. I think people are willing to give people grace for trying and I just think the more you practice, the better you get. And now I can do these videos in my sleep.

Speaker 2: 26:55

So because I've done literally thousands of them and it was not comfortable at first, but now it's like second nature.

Speaker 1: 27:02

Well, I mean, it sounds exactly like doing a podcast.

Speaker 2: 27:05

I was a nervous red to start this thing. Oh my gosh, I'm sure yeah.

Speaker 1: 27:09

And Sean kept saying because he had done multiple podcasts himself before he said just expect the first 10 to suck, they're just not going to be good, don't worry about it, just keep going. And sure enough they did. And I literally won't listen to the earlier ones.

Speaker 2: 27:25

Oh, I know, right, that just made me cringe. Totally, I get that.

Speaker 1: 27:28

But you just push through it, you keep on, you keep showing up day after day after day. You're going to get better. You're going to get over it. You're going to get more comfortable, absolutely so just keep the course Perseverance. Well, tell us your parting thoughts, your final tips to the small business owners Gosh yes, I love this.

Speaker 2: 27:49

I mean, a lot of women will reach out to me on Instagram, dm me and say how do you get started? Help me. I'm always willing to share my experience because honestly and I mean this truly I knew nothing about the industry. As I said, I Googled how to start an online boutique. I didn't have Instagram. It's like if you are willing to have humility and be able to ask all the dumb questions you know, and show up at a market on a non-apparel market day when everyone was closed and say I'm here and they're like we're not open, I mean I made a lot of mistakes, but I was willing to say I want to learn and I was passionate about what I was doing and I enjoyed every part of it, whether it was filling an order, as I said, or or, you know, being interviewed on your podcast. All elements of it have been really, really enjoyable and, like you said, you've got to keep going. Just plug it along.

Speaker 2: 28:40

I talked to so many women who are becoming ambassadors and they're like, oh my gosh, I just don't know if I'm being successful, like you are, because you're keeping going. So many people quit. You know, for me, I had to give this business at least a year to really get some, some foundation. You know it's something that you can't just do. You know for a month or two and hope for the best. And for me I was fortunate enough. My husband supported me when I quit my big corporate job and said, all right, and he about gave me a year. He goes, you got a year, let's see. And I was fortunate enough to make it, make it happen, and it's just grown from there. So a lot of hard work, but if you love what you do that old cliche is true it's like you're not really working, you're just really really enjoying every day and I have to say it has just been so much fun growing Avar over the last five years.

Speaker 1: 29:29

Like they say do what you love, the money will follow.

Speaker 2: 29:31

Right. I mean I used to think, oh yeah, whatever, but gosh, that's so true. And once I hit 40, I finally followed that advice and it's okay.

Speaker 1: 29:39

So you guys have done a phenomenal job and congratulations. You deserve all the success.

Speaker 2: 29:44

Oh well, thank you. And thank you to all of the bubble ladies who supported us all these years. I mean, we simply wouldn't have been where we are without all the support of the park cities, women. I mean, they just have loved us from the, from the jump. And all of our OGs are really special to us. Well, tell us how we can find you. Well, shopavaracom and we are shop underscore Avara on Instagram. You can't miss us?

Speaker 1: 30:09

Perfect, and I'll include that in the show notes for you all. Well, emily, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for sharing all of your wisdom. I really think you're going to help a lot of small businesses.

Speaker 2: 30:17

Well, I sure hope I do, and they are always free to DM me, because I'm always always happy to help, and thank you, martha, for having me.

Speaker 1: 30:25

This was a lot of fun Absolutely. We'll do it again sometime. That's been another episode of the bubble lounge. I'm Martha Jackson and I'll catch you next time.