Mr. Donavan - Parenting the Child That You Have, Not the Child That You Want

Speaker 1: 0:00

This episode is sponsored by Kathy L Wall State Farm Agency. Learn more at kathylwallcom and hellonannycom. Say hello, nanny, and goodbye to stress at hellonannycom and Stuart Arango Oral Surgery. Learn more at saoralsurgeonscom. Welcome to the Bubble Lounge.

Speaker 1: 0:25

I'm Martha Jackson and if you have lived in the neighborhood for any amount of time and you have kids, more than likely you know who Mr Donovan is. He is our guest this week and we were talking on the phone the other day and had a very interesting conversation about embracing the child that you have, not the child that you want. Basically, we're putting a lot of pressure on our kids for academics, athletics, socially, and what we're going to talk about is really learning how to respect your kids and meeting them where they are and not where you're wanting them to be, and help them grow and be more fulfilled. I am so excited to welcome back to the show Mr Donovan.

Speaker 1: 1:05

I wanted to give a personal thank you to our good friend and show sponsor, kathy Elwall State Farm Agency. We have known Kathy for more than 15 years and there is no person we trust more when it comes to insurance than Kathy Elwall. Kathy is always available to help you find the right insurance for your family needs, whether it's covering your home, auto or providing a life insurance policy tailored to the unique needs of families in Highland Park. My family trusts Kathy with our insurance and we hope you will too. Please visit kathylwallcom to learn more and let her know that Martha from the Bubble Lounge sent you. Mr Donovan, thank you so much for being here today.

Speaker 2: 1:42

Always happy to be here, always happy.

Speaker 1: 1:44

Well, there may be some people out there that actually don't know you, so can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what you do?

Speaker 2: 1:52

A little bit about what I do. Simple version is I get to be the surrogate uncle to all families. That simple, and then a life coach. But you know, I started out with skills and coaching but it evolved into something more than that. You know, now I do more counseling than anything, and now that I've done it for 35 years celebration of doing this I have a little bit of wisdom packed in. So I get to be the uncle status now instead of just a coach.

Speaker 1: 2:20

Well, my favorite thing is when I'm driving around the neighborhood and I see you in a yard working with a kid in the front yard of a house, and it just always makes me laugh and I roll down my window and say, hey there.

Speaker 2: 2:31

Everyone does. It's like the community feels like he's out in the yard again.

Speaker 1: 2:36

There he is. He's everywhere, everywhere. I love it. Well, you and I were talking on the phone the other day and we ended up having a very interesting conversation. Well, you and I were talking on the phone the other day and we ended up having a very interesting conversation. I was like we got to make this a podcast.

Speaker 2: 2:49

I have stories you really do I have stories.

Speaker 1: 2:52

Well, we were talking about how you are doing more counseling than coaching right now, and you've always been known for coaching and then you've always had this just really amazing insight of being able to kind of figure people out, especially kids, just like the moment that you start spending time with them. It's kind of surreal actually to watch.

Speaker 2: 3:12

It's like that sight beyond sight setup.

Speaker 1: 3:15

It's like you have a superpower.

Speaker 2: 3:16

Exactly exactly. You just meet people where they are and that's one of the biggest things I've been able to do. And again, a little bit back history. You know I everyone thinks that was this great football player or what have you know, and touching back on a few episodes that I've done with you guys, I was never the athlete, I was the skinny Steve Urkel kid.

Speaker 1: 3:38

I've seen pictures and he's not exaggerating. I mean, you would not recognize the guy.

Speaker 2: 3:43

Yeah, and now it. It's like I'm big and buff and the kids listen to me. Is it because I really think for the universe and for my faith and belief if, if I didn't go through the things I went through the bullying, the teasing which most people go through I had a little extra season in that, but it helped me to understand what a lot of kids are going through, and adults even, because we still carry those wounds and scars. And so that's where now the counseling aspect, because now I see it and I tell people listen, I've seen this story. Okay, let me save you some time. You know everyone needs to kind of get their toes wet, but let me save you some time.

Speaker 1: 4:23

Yeah Right. Well, one of the things that we were talking about is just this competitive nature of parents. And tell me what you're seeing. Obviously, you've worked with a ton of kids for many, many years. How have you seen this evolve? And what's going on right now? Whew.

Speaker 2: 4:41

Well, we all want the best for our children, we want the best for ourselves and sometimes we feel that when we're not doing our best, we could do better. However, children don't always have that voice and they don't have the acumen that we do as adults to say, hey, we're going to make this choice, I'm going to try harder, apply harder. It's easy to say after 40 years that, hey, you should do this, you should do that, but again, it's how it lands, it's how it's said, it's how it's presented. For instance, you know you have families that when I get there it's chaos, but I get to, as you've seen me work in yards, homes, but I get to, as you've seen me work in yards, homes and everywhere else. How do I get to walk into your home, not raise my voice, and the kids are waiting for me next week and they're just like don't leave. But I give them a voice and it's like a little bit of understanding.

Speaker 2: 5:40

Less is more, so that's, forgive me, that's what I see and it's just wild. So that's why I do more counseling than anything to help people understand the child and actually sometimes who they are Sure, and you end up digging up old wounds and things that they've never talked about, right, and then? So now one of the qualifiers is, when I meet new families, I ask them I go, what would you like to happen? I mean, yes, you saw me in this yard or whatever. That's the motive there. But what would you like to happen? And most can't tell me they can't, it's just mind blowing. I'm like, well, I saw you working with whomever, like, yeah, and that's a different set of circumstances, but what would you like to happen from our relationship that I developed with your family?

Speaker 1: 6:31

and it's like, oh, stunned fish well, what are some of the common pressures that you're seeing parents are putting on their kids right now obviously winning.

Speaker 2: 6:43

Winning is number one, yeah, and that comes at its own certain cost. It's a whole subject in and of itself, but what I'm seeing mostly is the pressure to win at all costs. And you know apply, apply, apply, more pressure. You're going to do this, do it this way. And the coaching is if there's some hidden agenda and it's like, hey, there should be some fun in this, it's not your life. If you want to compete, you should go to an adult league. And you know our job is to discipline, teach and love. But that's not love, that's just abuse.

Speaker 1: 7:23

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:23

I mean, if you went to work for a company and they treated you like that, you'd be an HR nightmare. But to your kid it's, try harder. Oh, okay, how does that land? How does it sound? And we have many societal examples of being pushed, sports and movie stars alike. But notable names and our biggest one is Michael Jackson, surey Brooke, schills, one of them, lindsay Lohan the list goes on and the Venus and Serena Williams. Sure, you can have that fame, but it comes at a cost and not everyone's willing or can't afford to pay that cost well, what do you think the motivation is for parents to be pushing their kids so hard?

Speaker 2: 8:06

things that they didn't get fulfilled, right, yeah, it's something that we all know. You know for my boys. Everyone thinks that what they see is. Everyone sees the movie of Mr Donovan as an example, but what they don't see or have seen is how this movie was made. I mean, you have on-location disasters, you have travel disasters, you have cost overruns and what have you, but this is the end product and this is years of battles and good, bad and indifferent and a lot of life lessons involved. And so this is me, and sometimes other families that I work with have the same thing, but they don't know how to compartmentalize it or deal with it. So it comes out. Their intent is wonderful, it's just how it lands. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 9:02

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Speaker 1: 9:57

Well, I grew up in a house where my father pushed my brother really hard and it's exactly what you're saying. It was to accomplish some things that he didn't. For example, he always thought it would be so amazing to play the guitar and sit around a campfire, and he never had any musical talent, he never pursued it. So he really pushed my brother to play guitar and it just wasn't something he was interested in. And there were arguments and you know every night when he'd say, get the guitar out, I'm like, oh God, like I'm running to my room, I don't want to be around it.

Speaker 2: 10:31

So I have seen firsthand what kind of impact that can have. Yeah, it's going back on one of our podcasts. Thank you again for having me again. You know we talk about how do you date. You know you're always dating. You know I want to brush my teeth, comb my hair and smell good and I want to invite you.

Speaker 2: 10:44

You know it's like a buffet. It's like you don't like the chicken Okay, how about the fish? It's like you don't like the chicken Okay, how about the fish? You don't like the fish. How about the lamb? You know options and I think one of the biggest things is we forget to give people options and recognize that, hey, they have their own feelings as well and we can get hell bent on. Okay, this is the way it should go. This is my movie, this is the way it should go. But it's like hold up, we're the actors in your movie. We don't exactly like the script because it doesn't fit us Right, and most people have a hard time with that.

Speaker 1: 11:20

Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. Well, what are some of the signs that you've seen with kids that you can? That are obvious signs that they are being pushed too hard and they are getting burnout and you can see the impact on them.

Speaker 2: 11:32

Oh, first of all is the eye roll, the facial expressions, the physical. You see that right off the bat. It's like well, come on, let's go to baseball. It's like watching paint dry Sure, yeah. And their movement is starting to get slow because, again, as children, they don't have any recourse. Or soccer is my worst, or my best example of it. You'll see where the kids are, just out in the field. They don't want to be there, and so you know they can't walk away, they can't go get in the car, they can't go get Starbucks. So you know what? For them to shut out what I call the noise. They're just on the field playing with flowers, oh yeah yeah.

Speaker 2: 12:11

They're just going to you know what. This is how they escape. You know what? There's a doodle bug on the ground. I'm just going to focus on the doodle bug. I don't want to play soccer it's hot. I don't want a juice box and you're yelling and all the parents are yelling loudly Again. If you worked in an environment like that, it'd be an HR nightmare.

Speaker 1: 12:34

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 12:35

So that's, that there.

Speaker 1: 12:38

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Speaker 2: 13:50

Think about some of the best hotels that you've been to. You become a concierge. I mean it's like, hey, I saw what you did and I know why you're here. Or like some of the best waiters on the best restaurant they know just when to serve you water, when to come back, not to interject, to let you lead, or really make a suggestion that may benefit you, such as hey, today we have a nice light salad. Or you know it's hot, you don't want a hot food.

Speaker 2: 14:21

You know, it's kind of like having the wherewithal to know beforehand and just think before, say pause, before send, and think about how it lands. You know, just take a deep breath and go hey, is it okay if I play soccer with you? Or hey, I saw this that I thought you might like. Would you like to try it? It's how you say it.

Speaker 2: 14:45

That's one of the biggest and easiest things to do is just understand how it lands. How does it sound to you? I mean, I'm talking to you nice again. Hey, martha, I'm gonna come do a podcast, oh okay. Hey, martha, I'd love to be up on your podcast again and I think it'd be great if you had me on. Or is it okay if I come and do another show with you sometime and it's almost just hey, almost like being vulnerable and just open to hey, I'm going with the flow. And most people they feel that if they go with the flow or be vulnerable, they lose control. And it's quite the opposite. Control is the ability to be vulnerable and understand where you are in this space.

Speaker 1: 15:31

Well, one of the things that we were talking about before we started recording was embracing the kid that you have, not the kid that you want, and I thought that that was a really interesting statement, because I've seen it firsthand is you know, football is a little bit popular here in Texas and a lot of parents are really pushing to have that football player and, you know, sometimes it's just not the right sport for the kid.

Speaker 2: 15:57

You know, I'll touch on this one, football and baseball as well. If you look at the makeup, genetic makeup of most baseball teams, where are they from? Cuba, dominican, chances of you making it to that? It's like yeah, you've got to be really good. Football is no different. It's a high-impact sport, it's an injury sport.

Speaker 2: 16:28

And then one of the things I've seen we have high schoolers, junior high kids, that are already in full knee braces left and right, knee elbow braces left and right, and they haven't hit high school. So my thought process is, by the time he finishes college and let's say he, she, they play sports, go on. They may not even be able to hold their children because their bodies are broken. What kind of quality of life are they going to have for what? And we've all seen the scary, slippery slope of what happens if you don't have the wherewithal or means to have physical therapy. After all those said injuries, it is not a good look. After all those said injuries, it is not a good look and in the case of others it's saddening. But there has to be a balance. It should be a balance. Support 100%. But when you're done, you're done. And I feel that a lot of parents don't give their children an opportunity to have an open voice.

Speaker 1: 17:29

Yeah, right, right. Well, I have a scenario I want to run by you. This is an interesting one. I had a friend whose son tried a whole lot of different sports. Tying in with your buffet analogy and I always like that you use that.

Speaker 1: 17:42

They tried all the sports and it just didn't really seem like being an athlete was going to be his thing. So she accepted that they stopped the sports for a number of years. And then, all of a sudden, as the kid is in middle school, he's watching his peers and he's seeing that the quote unquote cool kids are the sports guys. And he tells his mom you should have forced me to play football. No, it was his words, you should have forced me. And she said no, it was his words, you should have forced me. And she said absolutely not.

Speaker 2: 18:13

I agree with her Because that's just me projection.

Speaker 1: 18:17

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 18:19

That's a non-winnable situation. With my very own boys. What we did do is we offered a buffet, my wife and I at the time. We, you know you get to choose something each semester. You didn't have to do it, but you were going to choose some activity. I don't mind devil's workshop, right, but what you weren't going to do, the non-negotiable in the house was you just weren't going to be idle. It could be tennis, it could be art, but for the social and it was more of hey. One day you might go to school, and even now my boys did soccer and football, swimming, but to this day neither one of them plays those sports. Jordan went into band and now he's in Seattle and his biggest thing is hockey, hockey, who?

Speaker 1: 19:08

knew.

Speaker 2: 19:10

And we didn't, but we didn't have those options at the time. So he's almost 30, and Justin's 23. But they both love hockey. Now I took them to a few games, no interest, didn't force it down their throat. We had tickets and I would have been willing to do it, but they could care less about any of the sport. Realistically, as grown men, and my dad comes to the hockey game with us, I'm like sure, but hockey, okay. But again, that ties into having a buffet and choices, but no, standing your ground and saying no to the child that says you should have forced me. No, that's not how that works out Because, again, it has to be their idea and it's just mere projection.

Speaker 1: 19:54

Yeah right. Well, how can parents foster a healthy wait? I think I already asked that, didn't I Foster? Foster the balance? Basically I already asked that.

Speaker 2: 20:07

You know it's lead by example.

Speaker 1: 20:12

Wait, hang on. I know it didn't come out very well, but didn't I already ask it, sean, yeah you can ask it so when you and I were talking on the phone the other day, you were talking about counseling the parents specifically and I asked you do they actually listen to you and follow through with your recommendations?

Speaker 2: 20:35

They do and because they see that it works and it's, it's again, it's how it lands. Lately I've gone back, as things have turned over. When I work with my newer families, they're like they notice it. You never change your voice. I go. Why? Why should I yell at you? I'm not going to yell at you now. I'll yell to say, hey, good job. And hey, you know you're about to run out to the street or something like that, but no, we're having fun. And I'll yell to say, hey, good job. And hey, you know you're about to run out to the street or something like that, but no, we're having fun.

Speaker 2: 21:09

And I want to see you win in a positive way. And it's more than just winning on the field, it's winning at life. And you're setting up them to be successful and self-confident. When you're confident, you can do all sorts of things. When you're not, that's when it becomes obsessive and that's when you fixate on one thing that you have ultimate control over. And you'll see some of the parents well, I'm going to do tennis. Well, honey, your arms are short like T-Rex. You might make the net, but no, they foster that by leading by example, and that's how you do it. I'm going to go play. Again.

Speaker 2: 21:54

It goes back to dating. All the things that we've tied from earlier podcasts. It all ties back into this as well. How do you date? How do you lead by example? You set the example. One of the things I've done is I've asked a lot of my clients and now it's become standard and I tell them you're not the leader of a family, your family is a business. So you have a company culture. What is your company culture? What is your mission statement? Run it like a business.

Speaker 2: 22:23

The person that may be at the front desk may not be suited for the front desk. The person that's in sales may not be suited for sales. So you find what fits them and meets them where they are. You might even have to switch. I've seen it firsthand that hey, she's good at sales and very organized, but she's not in sales and he's good at front desk organization. Switch them. Company grows, understand the person, and that comes down to understanding the person, the child that you have and even yourself. You may not be an early riser. There's no law that says you have to get up at 6 am. There is no law. You may not be that person and that's okay. But if you understand who your team is, then you put all the players in the right place.

Speaker 1: 23:11

Watch the growth okay, that is a really interesting way to put it and I definitely want to incorporate that into our house. And you've got me thinking. I think I need to fire the toilet paper stock boy because he's not doing his job.

Speaker 2: 23:25

Yeah, I mean it's, it's, it's. You ask yourself where I am here and I want to go there. What is it going to take for all of us to pitch in? You know, we just growing up as a military child and seeing different things from different military families, the things that we have now as a society, back during the 70s and 80s we did not have. So I got to see a lot of the moms that were, by nature, single moms because the fathers were gone. Right. So I get it. Yeah, they were married, but they were single moms. Okay, but in this case, you were my mom, the lady next door was my mom. It was a community and I learned from that. There's a priority of hey, we're going to do this to be respectful of yourself, respectful of others, respectful of your team and definitely respectful of yourself, and you have those core values and that helps.

Speaker 1: 24:25

So, mr Donovan, you have been recovering from cancer for a few years now, and we were talking about your holistic approach to health and all the benefits that you've seen from it.

Speaker 2: 24:35

Yes.

Speaker 1: 24:35

And I just wanted to kind of tie that in with our kids, because our kids have a pretty bad diet these days.

Speaker 2: 24:42

Well, I can speak firsthand. Bad diet these days Well, I can speak firsthand. So, first of all, I'm thankful that I'm still able to do what I do 35 years into this and I'm still teaching some of the children, now adults, that I taught when I first started. I now teach their children.

Speaker 2: 24:57

So, I've crossed into that threshold. But one of the things I have seen that's different from when I started to now is diet and with me having my own health journey and being completely holistic. Now people see me and they're like man, you're beefed up, You're working out no, it's good nutrition and good diet, and watching specifically what I eat, because those things are factors. A simple version is this your body is a Ferrari and it needs premium fuel. You can put regular lead in it. Unleaded in it, It'll work, but it won't perform. Yeah right, It'll go, but it won't go.

Speaker 2: 25:36

And then it causes all sorts of issues. It doesn't get in the gear, it's sluggish Sounds like some of our children, right, Well, we get to control the fuel that goes in your bodies and that goes a long way for your health and maintenance. And that's the difference between you being done in five years and needing another one. Or you're running 300,000 miles, which I kind of feel that after 35 years I think I'm about half a million miles and I still got another half a million to go and willingly and wanting to. But again, it comes down to diet.

Speaker 1: 26:08

Yeah, I mean it's so important and you've seen some really great benefits from the changes you've been making.

Speaker 2: 26:15

Yes, and when you think about some of the things that we and I won't preach to anyone about this one, but just take a look at what if you can't pronounce it?

Speaker 1: 26:26

Pie doesn't need to be in your body. Pie doesn't need to be in your body.

Speaker 2: 26:28

Pie doesn't need to be in your body. I mean, sometimes we know more about the school choices that we've made. We know more about the car options that are on the car. We know where our travertine towel comes from, where it's sourced. Tell me I'm wrong. And I would like for everyone just to be aware of what they're placing in front of their mouth, and that's the one choice you do have control over of. Hey, I get to control what I do eat, okay, and what goes in my body, because it's my own temple that will carry me for many, many, many years and you have to take care of it, and I'm a living testament of that and I can't say enough about it. And so, when it comes to the children, I want them to have the best nutrition they could possibly have.

Speaker 2: 27:10

Now, granted, sure you can go to a party and have a bite or two of this, or even a lick of ice cream. You have to live, you're going to live and you should live, but some stuff you just shouldn't put in your body.

Speaker 1: 27:25

You always have the best analogies. I love the way that you frame things.

Speaker 2: 27:29

I was a weird kid. I had no friends, so I'd have to make conversations. Call my sister, she'll verify everything.

Speaker 1: 27:37

Well, do you have any final thoughts or advice to pass along to parents to make sure that they are raising healthy, well-adjusted kids?

Speaker 2: 27:45

Yes, First of all, you don't have to be their friend and boundaries are good ones, Healthy boundaries, healthy and I stress healthy as in mental, emotional, physical boundaries are healthy and good Boundaries are good. However, there's a lot of gray because that gives insight for interpretation and for them to make a few mistakes. But the core boundaries you should have Again, your family is a business and you have a mission statement and you will have much success when you have those core values in your company, ie your family.

Speaker 1: 28:28

Well, that is perfect. Thank you so much for being here today.

Speaker 2: 28:29

I love all the information you shared. I think you're going to help a lot of us out there. It's always a pleasure.

Speaker 1: 28:35

Well, that's been another episode of the Bubble Lounge. I'm Martha Jackson and I'll catch you next time.